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Okay, names so far: Tyr ~~Lowe~~ Andersen (Andersen I like but it's not fixed yet; Tyr is), Duane Keller (~~what do you guys think about Zane as a first name instead? it's the only one i'm willing to consider at this point,~~ because i like how Duane looks in writing and he IS from hick country anyway so it's not a huge problem that it sounds hick-ish. okay not zane but so far I can't really see anything else), Tracey Serrano, Cameron Gabriel Wright, Xiang Wei. (might become a chick too!)

I just realized tracey is a really vague character with little possibility for impact, apart from being the only other wolf. so either I cut him out entirely and make Gabe the other wolf, (but I don't know about a four-man band, i think it offends my odd number sensibilities or something XD) or I make him a woman (because a woman who's also really quiet and phlegmatic and soldier-ish is more interesting than a guy who'd probably come across as Tyr V.2 for a good long while.) Or... something else that I haven't figured out suggestions plz. I was already planning to have him have lost an eye *evil!* but that doesn't give me enough other stuff to go on, and it could be cool for a woman too. Or for Gabe. >___>

edit! Okay, Serrano stays as a girl. haha, now that she's an actual girl I might change Tracey for something else to get rid of the Tr start.

Wei, might become a chick as well, but if that's the case i'll look for another first name. I want something really flowery and cute. *cackles*

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I'd approve of either making Tracey a woman after all, or cutting it down to a four-man. It would change the template a bit. If you do include a woman though, make sure you include at least one Bechtel indicator. ;)

I have no idea what Bechtel indicator means in this context, and neither google nor wiki are any help. XD

I think I like having at least one woman in there. it means there were others out here, and more conflict later. Four-man, I don't know, they might separate into two pairs instead of stay a group with interconnected bonds.

Sorry, I spelled it wrong, Bechdel. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dykes_to_Watch_Out_For#The_Bechdel_test) XD Basically, it's a measure of whether women in a movie (or any story at all, really) are being treated as people or just accessories -- 1) Does it have more than one women? 2) Do the women talk to each other? 3) About something other than a man?

Oh, yeah, that.

Well, if Wei is a girl then that'll definitely happen and in a better way than just with secondary characters. I guess that's another reason to do it. XD

You should definitely replace Lowe, and I like Duane better than Zane. Zane is so . . . romance novel. Also, gets really overused in novels and nooot actually used near as much in actual LIFE.

WOMEN ARE GOOD. IN FACT TAKE A CHROMOSOME OFF XIANG OR GABE TOO. No seriously, things like badass Black Ops werebeast chicks? Need to happen so much more often, and replacing some Ys with Xs would definitely get you further from the G-boys.

Also, while missing eyes/limbs/kumquats sound cool and look interesting (and may I here add that I FULLY SUPPORT the idea of a female character being in some way scarred or maimed and not kept pretty and pristine on ridiculous odds just to "preserve her womanliness"), they are not actually character development unless they are the gun on the mantelpiece in act one and someone's getting shot in act three. Metaphorically speaking. So you should definitely talk/work Tracey out some more.

Yay one vote for Duane. Well, against Zane XD Alright then. now that i think about it, i think there's one guy in anita blake who's called zane and he's kind of a retard, so nevermind that.

Gabe is def. a guy (that's because he's nice and not as fighter-y and shit, so he's not allowed to be a chick because then urgh cliche) but the idea of Wei as a girl is an intriguing one. I shall ponder.

The missing eye is pretty much because what they did was really that dangerous and while they heal fast as a rule, it doesn't make sense that one of them at least hasn't healed of something that couldn't be actually regenerated (like if one of them lost a leg, the wound would heal real fast and without infection, but it wouldn't actually *grow back*.) Also there would be depth perception problems and a handicap in fighting situations, and it would likely lead to being the one who masters the use of their sense of smell the fastest. XD I don't want it to be plot-related in a "bring up the bad guy who took her eye out in the actual story" way. He gouged out her eye, she killed him and crawled home, the end. I don't know if that's what you meant, but dealing with the consequences of missing an eye is enough plot for me. Her reactions to it will hopefully give me moments which will develop her other sides by seeing how she deals with it.

If you like Zane and Duane, you might also like Shane - and living in hick country, I can tell you that it's not an uncommon name around here. (Dale is another good one if you like the idea of keeping that D-sound. It's also unisex - I know both male and female Dales. XD)

Oh, Shane sounds quite possible. HMMMM. I'll have to think about it more, but thanks for the suggestion ^^

My pleasure (especially since it's been one of my favorite names for years, between the book by Jack Schaeffer and Shane Gooseman from Adventures of the Galaxy Rangers. XD )

Personally I'm of two minds about Duane, I'm not so fond of it because of the Du start which makes me think of Duo (which is why I'm also glad your changing Lowe to Andersen), but I also really like the name itself. Additionally, I would really like if there was at least one woman (two would be great too) but generally I'm pretty impressed with all of your writing so I'm sure I'll enjoy it either way.

I may be mis-reading how she wants Duane to be said, but the spelling "Dwain" or "dwane" are more common in the midwest, where I'm from originally, which might help. I really really like the name though; it manages to sound poetic and hick-ish at the same time to me, and I find the tension neat.

Sorry--this is lissiel, but I deleted my LJ so now I'm always anon.

I like the name a lot as well, (the mix of hick name on a cool character is win) but I'm worried even the Dw will still make me associate it with Duo now that I've seen Duane.

This only proves, however, how miss wired my brain actually is and I'm sure I'll find a way to cope if the names stay as is.

MAYBE I CAN GIVE YOU ADVICE FROM A NEVER-SEEN-GUNDAM PERSPECTIVE 8D

Also without beating linguistics to death; the following is about equal mix writer's perspective and layman's perspective.

While I like the name "Tyr Andersen," I've always been a little wary of very-unique names (Tyr, that is). I'm kind of curious as to why you latched onto that one so firmly? Maybe I'm missing something obvious not having seen Gundam, but then if you're trying to make this an ofic anyway...

Then again, better to have been named Tyr than to have picked it up as a nickname, because then there's all kinds of GaryStuness and posturing happening. *shrug* I am of two minds!

Also, I do like "Andersen," but it makes me think of Andersen from Hellsing. XD Adding a Norse name to that doesn't help. FEAR ME; I AM KIND OF INSANE. If you're going for a not-uncommon-but-not-common-either name (which, Andersen is in that range), I'd go for Flescher (from the German fleischer, butcher), Fletcher (as in one who makes arrows), Cooper (barrel-maker), Benedict, Simmons... If you want a somewhat more common name, suggestions I have include Samson, Rogers, the ever-used Smith, Spiker/Speicher (spelling depends on your degree of separation from Germanic heritage), Hunter (which also makes a good first name, though perhaps a little too obvious for this fic in either case).

Then of course there are first-names-as-last-names or thereabouts, i.e. Adams, Avery, Johns, Michaels, Beverly...

While I do not agree with previous comments that Duane/Dwayne sounds hickish/common/low (I'm from Maryland, which is just about halfway between "the South" and "New England" on the US east coast), it does feel a bit old or archaic, like it would have to have been a family name. Shane sounds better and feels less awkward; it's common enough that it doesn't really get a second thought, while not so common I go "oh it's another one of those" (as is the case with Michael/Mike, John, Robert/Bob, Joseph/Joe, Matthew/Matt...). Alternatively, as it's similar to Shane: Shawn/Sean is a good name. Slightly less common and a tiny bit old-fashioned, but not in a bad way.

I like Keller either as a first or last name. It works well, in general.

For now-Tracy Serrano, if you're keeping Serrano as the surname, some suggestions for female names that sound good with it are Melinda, Rachael, Melissa, Bethany, ~~Cameron~~ (whoops haha nevermind), Christina (not Christine), Amelia. All mildly old-fashioned (or at least not super contemporary) and/or more "proper-sounding" to my ear, and all seem to follow a nice rhythm with Serrano (3-syllable, for the most part; I don't know why Rachael works, but it does sound nice).

I very much like "Cameron Gabriel Wright;" it flows very well with itself. Also the very slightly old-fashioned (very slightly) quality as well as the androgyny of "Cameron" lend well to "Gabe" being used as a nickname.

Additionally, I approve of the loss of an eye as a character device rather than a plot device. It's nice to see characters being given flaws that add to and develop them as characters without having to devote real focus to it. It's a pet peeve of mine when characters' only real flaws are fixable, resolvable, and/or revengeable (it's a word now, dammit; I got three hours of sleep), and are then fixed/resolved/revenged (there is a better word than "revenge" that is lost in my vocabulary right now, beh) in the course of the story as an important plot point. Let your characters have flaws that can be dealt with without actually being directly addressed and/or resolved, people! *shakefist*

I would address Wei but I am useless with Chinese names. |D;;;;

I am not sure if that came across as friendly/helpful advice or me standing on a soapbox and ranting at you loudly and monosyllabically, but know I meant it as the former. |D; I am very tired.

XD he's officially named tyr, it's not a nickname. the guy who named him was an old mythology professor who didn't have much of a clue about what to do with children and appropriateness. He couldn't think of anything else. (he hesitated about going with thor or loki, but the kid was born on a tuesday, so that's how he made up his mind. >__>;;; )

I've never read the Hellsing manga and can't remember much from the anime and if I had to strike out every single name that was used elsewhere I wouldn't have much left. :p Andersen is on several lists of 20 most common names from... I forget which nordic countries, but several countries. He's not american and it's not rare where he comes from. (Actually only one of them is american --well, anglo-saxon at least, because Serrano is probably from a spanish-speaking community in the USA. Gabriel is british-french.)

Shawn is a pretty name, but I dunno, it feels too soft. Argh, so hard to rename, that one.

All the names for Serrano you gave me sound nice with the family name, but none of them really suit her. XD;; She's... extremely androgynous, so a too-feminine name sounds off, but when I looked on behindthename it was REALLY hard to find a name that didn't sound very feminine, at least to me. They're all so melodious and they end in -a which sounds really girly to me... At first I was tempted by Tere (short for teresa but since the -a ending was gone it didn't seem as soft) but that's even closer to Tyr than Tracy is, so nevermind with that. Maybe Carla... with the proper accent that R would make sure the name doesn't sound too soft, but argh, I don't know if it fits either. *flopwhine*

granted i could get around that by giving her a pretty, normal-girl-y first name (i like melissa and christina for it) and then never having anyone use it, like, ever. XD

yeah, i think i like the eye thing because she's *adapting* to it instead of just going "something horrific happened so i must make it as if it didn't happen" which okay can be a cool plot devide but the story isn't called "how carlita got her eye back". Something as major as regrowing an eye would make that healing thing a way bigger factor in the story's universe as a whole, and that's just not how i see things, so it would look out of place and kind of speshul if it happened.

thank you for the comment, you made me think so yay ^^

-- WHY AM I NOT WRITING. OH SELF. BAD. BAD.

Andersen would not be an unusual surname around here, but then we have a lot of Scandinavian names around here (mostly Finns and Swedes in this neck of the woods). "Here" being northern Michigan. What is common or not in the US really, really, depends on the region. Most of our states are as large, or larger, than European countries and when it comes to things like the commonality of names it doesn't really hurt to think of them as countries just to get the scale right.

As for Ms Serrano, I'd be inclined to Jesse. Spoken it could be taken as a short form of Jessica and written the form "Jesse" is unisex though for a girl it would be more likely to spell it Jessie or even Jessi.

There's a decent list of unisex names here and a longer one at BehindTheName but I'm sure a lot of those don't sound that unisex outside the US. I rummaged through there a couple NaNos ago trying to find a handful of unisex names. Ironically in that same story I think on a pair of names that, to my ear and accent, sound the same and ended up on the two characters closest to my MC. It works, for various reasons, but eventually that Erin/Aaron confusion is going to have to pop up in the story.

And now I really should get back to finding a plot for this year's NaNo so I don't end up describing my MC's wardrobe and philosophy of shoes or something for 50k.

I dunno, the way i'd pronounce Jesse Serrano would be like jesssserrano or jes'serano which is just weird ^^;

whee, thanks for the links, will look. ^___^ (later! later! When i'm done with today's bit. Augh. *pulls self away from shiny links*)

... bwahahaha oh dear. still no plot? XD;;;; what's it about?

Pronunciation does do a number on names, the terminal "e" is pronounced around these parts.

Not even a hint of a plot. I left her heading out to "Abraham's", who, or more importantly, what, Abraham is I haven't figured out yet.

The problem is I have a character that just dropped in my head, said "My name is Apollonia Gail Westerfeld, I wear a suit to work and I probably do something supernatural in my off hours. My assistant at my day job is actually my lover and he's a full head shorter than I am when I actually wear my shoes. He's not short though, I'm just that tall."

The housemate suggested that she's an insurance auditor for her day job and hunts ghouls for the supernatural side of things but the ghoul thing isn't really working for me. Since Saint Apollonia is the patron of people with tooth pain I was toying with her being the tooth fairy but that really, really isn't working for me either.

In short, I don't know what it's about because I don't know what Apollonia does other than make suits and heels look amazingly sexy. :(

This would probably go better if Ms. A.G. Westerfeld had given me more info and more than a day to think about it before writing. My characters are brats a lot of the time.

... Attorney who takes cases for free for vampires? XD;;; they want a legal existence! or they have one but are discriminated against! (no wonder, some of them even try to snack on her sometimes. As if. Sir, please, control yourself. >__>)

Hmm, generalized supernatural beings I think, lets me put in that old werecat character. :D I think she's going to stick with number crunching rather than law, but everyone needs a good accountant to manage their finances when they're undead, or whatever. XD

How do you pronounce Tyr. Is it like the tire on a car? I have no idea!

Sort of like Teer. ^^

If you like Tere, why not Terry? That one's used by both genders in the US, and it's a lot more common spelling than Tere. A lot of women will spell it Terri, but by far not all.

Since you specifically mentioned that you were thinking of her growing up in a Spanish-speaking area of the US/North America (you might want to think about which area - the Cubans in Miami are very different culturally from the Puerto Ricans up in New York or the Mexicans in the US) I won't suggest Robin, even though I personally knew a girl named Robin Hood at one point, who was named after her father, Robin Hood. (True story, I swear! XD )

Yeah but Tyr has a T and a R and Terry has a T, a R AND a Y XD

It's a divergent history earth, so I'm taking it as an excuse to play fast and loose with some ethnic stuff, since i don't have time to research as much as i'd want. i'd never write otherwise. i'll correct anything that looks out of place to people, but, yeah. That stuff will likely have to wait for the second draft.

What about Carmen Serrano? Still spanish, not ending with an -a...

i have bad associations about carmen XD;;;;;

*pas difficile du tout la fille* ._.

T'es effectivement difficile ! :D (Combien avais-je raison de partir des noms des personnages pour construire l'histoire autour plutôt que le contraire ! :DDD)

Un prénom en -in(e) alors ; pour tes anglophones de lecteurs, ça devrait rester mixte comme prénom, en sonorité... Pas très espagnol par contre, j'en ai peur (ou il y a vraiment bcp de -a).

En même temps... tu peux considérer que les parents n'avaient peut-être pas dans l'idée que leur fille serait androgyne et soldat en grandissant alors elle *peut* avoir un prénom... qui ne lui va pas du tout (raison pour laquelle elle reste Serrano, lol).

Bon, par contre, y'a un truc dont je viens de me rappeler à l'instant. J'ai un micro doute mais il me semble bien que ce sont pour les Espagnols (et non pas les Portuguais) mais les Espagnols ont 2 noms de famille : celui du père et celui de la mère (donc, en fait, ceux des grand-pères paternel et maternelle). Une vraie Espagnol ne serait donc probablement pas appelée Serrano mais Serrano Garcia (enfin tu vois, quoi). Je ne me souviens plus lequel des deux est le premier entre le nom du père et le nom de la mère. J'imagine que pour abréger, si un seul doit être conservé, ce serait probablement celui du père... mais ça reste à prouver. (En tout cas, un Espagnol qui se fait naturaliser en France choisit l'un des deux pour devenir son nom de famille "français", il ne conserve pas les deux. Et les prochains membres de sa famille à se faire naturaliser devront prendre ce même nom même s'ils auraient préféré porter l'autre.)

I am 100% for Tracey and Wei being ladies. ♥

In China, repetitive names for girls are common, so you could just go with Xiang Weiwei (although that might cause some childhood teasing in the form of Xiang Wei = nice smell).
Because I am a sadistic soul, I also suggest the name Shasha or Bai Xue (a guyish name that is a homonym for...Snow White).

But that would be so cutesy? I always learned of double words as mostly nicknames..

/anonymous lurkage

You know, Miss Serrano could always just go by her surname. It's not an extremely common thing, but I've known a few guys who used their last name as a sort of nickname because it sounded cooler than their first name, they liked tormenting teachers taking role (read: it's fun to make people try to say Fuchs with a straight face), there were tons of people within the immediate community with the same name, umm what do you mean Michele is a girls-only name in the US?, etc. I don't know any girls who do this, aside from one friend I decided should go by her last name because it rhymes with a type of breakfast pastry, but you say she's pretty androgynous, so. If she had a flowery name like Amelia but acted pretty masculine, it could make sense that friends wouldn't want to call her by it.

BUT I could totally understand if going by a surname made relationships seem less... um, personal? More standoffish? Some unisex/masculine girl names I like are Riley, Imogen (...although I don't think this one is very common, at least not in the US -twiddles thumbs-), Hayden, Taylor, Madison... and now I'm just babbling, ehehehe. I suck at coming up with names, sorry.

I hope that was somewhere close to helpful, or at least amusing. :D

Just came by a name I thought you might find interesting; Jian. Feminine or Masuline is fine. Chinese origins.

I can't think of Serrano as any other name, you know. I really really don't know why, but I keep thinking her name is only Serrano or Serrano Something, and not that Serrano is a last name. Why can't it be a first name, btw?

Ohh, jian is pretty.

Serrano can't be a first name because that's not how spanish or italian uses it. I don't think they have the "use a last name as a first name" custom at all, no baby sites show it as a first name. Also no one calls her by her first name, so if i make it her first name i'll have to change everything to have people call her lopez instead. XD

Isn't it? ^_^

I see... She suits Serrano though, I think? I don't watch Gundam Wing, so I wouldn't know what ~~her~~ his actual name was.

Oh, I like Zane. Very uncommon, though it does scream midwestern-US even louder than Dwayne/Duane. But were you thinking hick country in terms of US-midwest, or hick country being East Coast (Appalachia) or hick country being northern-west (Wyoming, Montana)... because, uhm, it's a big country so we kinda have a LOT of hick areas.

*snerk*

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IS MERCILESS BUT TO BE FAIR YOU ASKED. >>;;

Re: IS MERCILESS BUT TO BE FAIR YOU ASKED. >>;;

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