askerian | Naruto spoilers

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Naruto spoilers - rant

This is a rant that's based on spoilers. The chapter isn't up yet. I hope when it's up I can concentrate on the awesome of the pictures, instead of the retarded fans.

I will bitchslap the next person who tells me anything that can be construed as "Hinata was stupid for getting in the middle of something that didn't concern her and she got what she deserved."

As for "Oh, no, she didn't CONFESS HER LOVE it was just ADMIRATION and LIKE, she doesn't even really KNOW him so it doesn't matter!" ... What. :|

The script:

*Hinata appears in front of Naruto*
Pain: "Reinforcements?"
Naruto: "Hinata, why? Get out. This person will just brush you away"
Hinata: "Yup".
Hinata: "This is my happiness".
Hinata: "I am here now of my own will."
I remember my old self... From here I was thinking of cheering you on in a variety of ways,
yet I was always rescued by Naruto-kun's smiling face.
Hinata: "If it's to protect Naruto-kun, my life doesn't matter."
Hinata: "I love Naruto-kun, that's why..."

Facts: she knew she wasn't good enough. It's not a case of "overstepping her bounds" (WTF) or "thinking herself better than she is". She knew. She didn't care. Saving Naruto > Her life. How is sacrificing herself for the man she loves stupid? Even if it's pointless in the end, she could not have lived with herself if she hadn't even tried.

What is "smart" in this situation? Staying hidden in her corner, watching as Naruto is taken away to be killed and the resulting weapon used to destroy all the ninja countries? Oh yeah, she would have been sure to live longer. A bit.

Some people deliberately place survival higher than honor and protecting your own. Most people are just cowards who would have wanted to try but been unable to bring themselves to. Where in Hinata's character had she shown the cynicism to deliberately say "it's useless, so I won't even try, I'll just give up beforehand" ? Her whole life has been a study in getting past her fear and giving-up issues, how is it stupid that she finally reached the goal of strength and bravery she aimed for?

Some readers might have the firm personal belief that self-sacrifice is stupid and pointless, and interpret the text from that point of view. Fine. But it's not Naruto's opinion, not Konoha's opinion in general -- Yondaime was a hero for giving his life, Jiraiya was a hero for giving his life -- for in-universe values (and Japanese values in general) sacrificing yourself like that, because you believe it's the right thing to do, even if it won't change a thing? It's noble. Really noble.

(You can even interpret it as : she bought Naruto time. She bought him another chance to get free or be rescued -- even though she didn't know if he or other watchers would manage to do anything with it, she still bought it for him. Because as long as you don't give up there might be another chance to win.

Turns out with him going Kyuubi, there's another chance now! Le gasp.)

Facts: Everyone has to watch the fight because they wouldn't last two seconds, they all know it and it really galls but they have no choice. They're not at Pain/Naruto level, the end. Hinata wanted to intervene anyway. Naruto was still somewhat holding his own. She was stopped and seemed to accept it.
Interpretation: OMIGAWD SHE DOESNT TRUST NARUTO TO SAVE TEH DAY ITS PROOF THAT SHE DOESNT KNOW HIM AT ALL.
1) if it was just admiration and deep respect she feels for him, she would firmly believe that he doesn't need her to fight and win. It's obvious she cares for his wellbeing more than she admires his strength, though she probably does both.
2) everyone already knew they'd be useless; she did, too, but she didn't care because she was more worried for Naruto than for herself.

Facts: In this chapter Naruto is toast. Everything he did was countered, he was trapped, the bad guy free to do whatever he wanted. This time Hinata intervened, said "I love you" and tried to protect him.
Interpretation: OMIGAWD HOW IS IT ANY OF HER BUSINESS. BUTT OUT ALREADY.
1) What.
2) No, what.
Interpretation: Daisuki doesn't mean love, it means like, and it can totally be used in a platonic way.
1) No it can't, especially not in this situation. Look at the context for god's sake. If she just felt admiration, she would say "you are too cool/great/needed to be allowed to die here" as a reason why she's getting killed for him, not "I love you". Are your true feeling the kind of thing you want to be misleading people with when it could be your last words? You'd really have to be a twisted dickhead.

Facts: She falls and there's a lot of blood and Naruto seems to believe Hinata kicked the bucket.
Interpretation: She's not dead, hah, as if Kishi killed any of the Konoha 12 anyway. Sakura, Tsunade and the slugs are around to fix her, and it's not like anyone has died of a simple stabbing in this manga.
Interpretation: She's dead because she declared herself and reached the completion of her theme and her death gave the plot more impact than her continued existence.
1) I can see why you'd think that, but where's her three chapters of flashback? ;p
2) Her themes deal with getting the courage to reveal herself to Naruto and proving herself worthy to the Hyuuga clan and her father as an heiress. Unless there's something about how Neji (or Hanabi, dragged out of the background characters bin) takes that over for her as a legacy...
Interpretation: It's proof that SasuNaru/NaruSaku will happen! With Sasuke an irredeemable villain/Sakura a useless slut and the fat bitch dead for daring to hit on Sasuke/Sakura's man, nothing can get in the way anymore!
1) Fuck you.
2) No, really. Fuck you.

I don't care whether you ship NaruSaku, SasuNaru, NaruHina, KibaHina or PakkunSakura. I really fucking don't.

But if you think like that then I don't want to talk to you.

I'm not even going to bother countering the sasunaru crap because anyone who thinks the manga will ever show them as more than best friends needs a reality check with a shitload of zeros. But the narusakutards who think their pairing can only happen when Hinata is bashed to hell and back and made into a stupid whore with an unhealthy obsession? It makes the pairing look ugly.

I'd think people who honestly ship NaruSaku or some other competing pairing would accept that Hinata is a nice girl, that her feelings are indeed strong and sincere, but that *gasp* Naruto isn't in love with her so it doesn't matter in the end! And that he'll have to very sadly tell her "I'm glad but I'm sorry, I don't feel that way/I'm in love with someone else", or that Hinata will do the noble thing and step down in favor of Sasuke/Sakura because as long as Naruto is happy it's okay with her! Hell, even if it doesn't happen like that in the manga it's still a perfectly useable explanation for fanfiction!

But I'm fucking sick and tired of people who honestly think that Kishimoto would piss on his characters and his themes and his whole manga just to satisfy the petty hate of people who don't seem to trust that their pairing of choice can happen outside of a vacuum where all potentially interfering characters are vilified and theirs is the only interaction that has any kind of depth or meaning.

I'm sure it goes for NaruHina retards who assume that Sakura is a jealous, evil bitch who secretly hates Hinata and that Naruto never really liked her anyway, but I don't ship NaruHina at all so I haven't been seeing that much. And I KNOW it goes for sasunaru twits, but I've given up on them already.

But shit. Just because you vilify Hinata's behavior and feelings doesn't make your pairing more likely. Your pairing having deep, positive moments in the manga makes your pairing more likely.

Why the fuck do I hang out at Narutofan.com again. It's a cesspool of fail and hate.

NaruHina can become as cute and adorable and canon as they want, and I'm still going to have fic-Naruto ditch her for Sasuke and Sakura. X3 Mmmmhh ot3.

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Pairing Wars = Stupid. End of story. Just this past convention I actually had someone get mad at me for not featuring a particular pairing when they noticed I had another pairing in my prints. He copped some serious 'tude because I said that, in general, it wasn't my cup of tea. Never said I would never draw it, just that I wouldnt' draw it "for me" (as most of my art tends to be "for me", the likelihood of it showing up was slim >D;)

Onto HInata. It sounds like she's having a Moment of Awesome. I'd personally hope she doesn't die, as I have too much love for her (we'll probably be strung along a bazillion chapters waiting for an answer like we are with Kakashi lolz), but this sounds like a decent way to die. (I doubt he'd kill her. He didn't kill Gaara, when I think he should have, so... :P)

Yeah, it's not like it will change canon or delete everything you see your chosen couple as being like together for fuck's sake. ~__~ And I really hate that entitled consumer attitude that as writers/artists we're supposed to produce what people want to see instead of what we want to create. Thankfully most people are really great about it, but the rare few who don't get it are always completely obnoxious about it.

As for Hinata, well, hard to say without the panels, but some people are already LOLing because she was slammed down after one attack and that means she's lame. =____= yeah, against Pain, the guy who flattened Konoha singlehandedly. It really depends on how the chapter will show it happening, but even just the intent behind her act is awesome IMHO. (yeah, or chouji -- i mean i love him for being so cute and loveable but he hasn't brought too much to the plot on his own, it felt like he was saved to keep sasuke from being irredeemable by causing one of his peers' death and shikamaru from being hardened too soon. It would have broken him into someone irrepairably cynical and dark back then. Contrast to Asuma's loss that tempered him like steel. X3)

"Daisuki doesn't mean love, it means like, and it can totally be used in a platonic way."

Actually, that arguement is stupid in another way, I am learning Japanese and both of my teachers have told me that Japanese culture would only use Daisuki, especially on another person, when they really mean they really love it. It translates to BIG Like, which is like Love. My teacher even told me that when she was dating her future husband, she didn't use Daisuki until after they were married. So as a cultural thing, Hinata saying Daisuki is pretty much her declaring her undying Love, you would not say Daisuki to imply a platonic relationship.

Just felt like I should point that out ^.^

I hate fantards of all flavors. especially the ones who try to sound intelligent.

"Dear fantard-so-and-so. The mangaka called, they want their creation back!"

"Most people are just cowards who would have wanted to try but been unable to bring themselves to."

YES. YES. AND YES AGAIN. DAMN. YOU SUMMED UP MY VABS IN SHINY, SHINY HAPPINESS.

"Your pairing having deep, positive moments in the manga makes your pairing more likely."

This is so damn true, the whole other theme of the freaking series is comradship. Everyone has touchy feely bits in this series, doesn't mean its GOING TO HAPPEN. If that were true the Sand Sibs would be all over each other! D:

"But I'm fucking sick and tired of people who honestly think that Kishimoto would piss on his characters and his themes and his whole manga "

agreeagreeagree. It really irks me as a lack of respect for him and his work. He created the characters so you actually have the fraking fandom. I wish people would stop bitching that Kishi hates their favourite characters or loves characters they hate and specifically did things cause of it yadayadayada.

"Why the fuck do I hang out at Narutofan.com again. It's a cesspool of fail and hate."

I got out of there after a month. x__x Just couldn't stand it.

I really like what you say. :) I guess my problem with it (and I have nothing against Hinata) is that BECAUSE she knew she wasn't good enough to do any damage to Pain... she shouldn't have done it... because to NARUTO, her death would hurt more than getting beaten up a bit more.

I know that now she's "dead" (or maybe not *is still hoping Kakashi is alive* *...hell, is still almost hoping SIRIUS BLACK is still alive*) Naruto has enough fury to turn Kyuubi and maybe beat Pain... but I felt like it was almost a bit cheap? It wasn't even a tear-jerker like when Sasuke dove in front of Naruto during the Haku battle (and I'm not saying that as a SasuNaru fan). It just felt a bit like "GAH! That was NOBLE, but all you did was get yourself killed, which is NOT worth it!!!"

...I think at this point, so many people are dying, it's not even heartrending anymore? People are just feeling tired of it all?

PS - I have to agree, tho - I understand people who hate a character if it gets in the way of their OTP, but I hate people who villainize that character and refuse to see them for who they are. (Poor Sakura really needs a break.)

Umm, not trying to be argumentative, you understand... jsut trying to add to the conversation? :)

XD ♥

I heard that kind of thing, but since I don't speak japanese it's just hearsay for me, so thanks for saying that. ^__^

Some people have the impression that if you don't say "aishiteru" it doesn't count, when I've heard many times that aishiteru is just not used very often and only in cases of WE ARE SOULMATES FOREVER AND EVERRRR or maybe "we've been married twenty years and will be married forty more years" or something.

I understand your point of view, but in-universe I think Hinata just thought she'd rather he was alive and grieving for her, than she was alive and had let him die when she could have helped. He's not in love with her, after all.

I don't think Naruto went Kyuubi for Hinata specifically -- she was more like the straw that breaks the camel's back and so he totally lost it. If Chouji or Shika had done it he would probably have raged the same way.

As for the lack of impact from a storytelling point of view, yeah, that might happen, depends how the pictures and the pacing of the chapter will look to me but I could see that happening. It's a case of what the reader will take to heart there, I think. If the pictures look sufficiently shocking and beautiful I'll probably sniffle a bit, and Hinata fans too. XD if it's drawn like "ehhh"... Come on Kishi, don't disappoint us, make it pretty! >:O

As for Kakashi, I read spoilers that were kinda... I don't remember the wording but it was kind of "omg fukusaku is dead! and shizune is dead! and kakashi is badly mangled and lost all his chakra! -- wait, they didn't say "dead"? :O " Might be wrong, though. I still believe he's not dead yet -- he had less buildup and flashback than Asuma and he hasn't seen Sasuke again! that's just not right. XDDD *I BELIEEEEEVE KAKASHI-SENSEIIIII*

Everyone has touchy feely bits in this series, doesn't mean its GOING TO HAPPEN.
Yeah, I really don't like it how some shippers make it look like if it's not followed by fucking, all this bonding and friendship and nakama-ing doesn't matter. Romance is really not one of the main themes at all, here. Friendship and family are. Even Hinata=>Naruto has respect, admiration and liking underneath, not pure heart-fluttering romance. And every single relationship Naruto has is based on platonic feelings.

Iruka => father. Kakashi => uncle and team leader. Sasuke => best friend, brother and teammate (yeahright *cough*). Sakura => friend, teammate and either big sister of sorts or potential girlfriend, (but even if she is, the main portion of their bond is not romance.) Tsunade => aunt/mom/grandma (he really doesn't relate to her like a herarchical superior). Gaara => mirror/dark twin => friend. Konohamaru => student, little brother.

So fucking it all up because Naruto is fucking someone you don't approve of is just... no.

*huggles*

Don't let them get you down!

Oi. This is why I stopped hanging out on forums and looking at chapter spoilers. That and for whatever reason most fans on the forums can't seem to type at a 2nd grade reading level. But I digress...

I well and truly hope Hinata survives. I mean, I'm too far into my fanfic to change things now :). No, seriously, it'd be nice if one of the characters near and dear to my heart made it out of this alive! Besides, healing her would give that little slug thing on Naruto's arm something to do.

On the plus side, beating the crap out of Hinata is a tried and true method of getting Naruto to tear your dumb ass apart. So in that regard, Pain did all right. Hopefully it will remind Mr. Uzumaki that difficult questions on world stability and peace, while excellent problems to debate and struggle with, are not the most opportune subjects to think about ON A FUCKING BATTLEFIELD! And perhaps further, that whatever the answer to world peace might be, building a giant freaking bomb to blow up the world over and over again doesn't qualify.

I found the last chapter somewhat irritating....

But yeah, if you wanted a good way to make people really, really hate Pain, you found it. Picking on the woobie (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheWoobie) of the series is bound to piss someone off. And let's remember, as bad as Naruto's position currently is, Pain's down to his last body, and Kyuubi hasn't even entered this conversation yet. I'd be interested to see what Pain's gravity wave can do to that Chakra shroud.

♥ Oh, no worries, I just like going RARRRR. After that it's all better. XD

*huggles*

Sorry I spoiled you then? XD;;;;

I really would be surprised if she died so easily. XD

On the plus side, beating the crap out of Hinata is a tried and true method of getting Naruto to tear your dumb ass apart.
... Ahaha, I didn't even think about that as a parallel! Naruto vs Neji II, the return of the kyuubitastic beating! XD Bit stretched because the context is so different, but still funny to think about Pain getting an uppercut in the teeth.

Yeah, the last chapter... Why do they let Pain talk, srsly. XD Just because he's super cynical doesn't make him even just a little bit right. He's a nihilist -- good for him. Naruto is a captive audience, literally, and faced with a sudden barrage of threats and angst he's floundering to look for an answer -- that doesn't mean there isn't any. Naruto will find a way, and it's not gonna be "you're totally right, Pain-sama." But all that preaching, blargh. *haets*

I'd be interested to see what Pain's gravity wave can do to that Chakra shroud.
... ooh. Oh, yes. *__*

... also curse you for linking to TVTropes. BUT HAH I READ THIS PAGE BEFORE SO I DON'T NEED TO CLICK. *... checks to see if it was updated anyway* ... damn it.

I’ve said it before; I’ve mostly stopped reading the manga because some things have started to frustrate me! (And your commentary is more fun anyway!) But it sounds like Hinata had a moment of Awesome. I don’t particularly connect with the character on many levels but I think that you’re right, this is who she is. I can’t see the Hinata who has been fighting to BE something all her life letting this chance to help protect her friend even if means death.

What I don’t get is how people miss the fact that she is ninja! I mean, really. Logically, at some point she is going to die. And it might not be her choice then! (Not saying that’s why she did it, this is Naruto after all and Naruto is Naruto to a lot of people who will fight for him because they can.)

Ship wars are crazy. =) Shade of the Leaf is a Saku/Naru story, it says it’s a Saku/Naru story and I still got reviews saying “When is he going to go after Hinata?” or “When is Sasuke going to jump Hinata?” People can be just a bit crazy about things going the way they want them to. It sucks, it makes you want to tear your hair out and unfortunately it’s not limited to the fourteen year olds anymore.

I stand by the fact that Kishimoto doesn't have the stones to kill off Kakashi :3

"Ship wars are crazy"

tell me about it. I think that's some of why I ended up following a crack pairing when I was heavy into naruto than something "conventional". People were too busy going "..wtf?" to yell at me for how wrong I was :D

Gyah. Where do you find these people? Or did I just not hang around chuunin long enough? lol

I agree on all parts about Hinata. There's no f-ing way she'd sit back and watch Naruto die. Am I happy Kishimoto went there? No. But that's just my own personal thing. I'm certainly not asking anyone to help me start an angry mob or anything. XD (she's totally not dead anyway. i'm really shocked at the number of people taking naruto's rarr panic! as proof of the situation. blood =/= dead. lol)

"... Ahaha, I didn't even think about that as a parallel! Naruto vs Neji II, the return of the kyuubitastic beating! XD Bit stretched because the context is so different, but still funny to think about Pain getting an uppercut in the teeth."

And really, its one of the best ways to deal with him. Pop out a a dozen clones, and start to bum rush him. Pain throws up his wave of doom. Use the resulting cloud of oncoming debris to hide your move, pull a kakashi and quickly dive into the ground, manuever under him, then leap out and punt him while he's between wave bursts. Only instead of an uppercut, you plant a rasengan in his face.

After all, Pain's attack is powerful, but it pretty much relies entirely on him being able to see and counter the enemy's attack. If he's, say, taken by surprise, or facing opponents who hold back one attack while distracting him with another? He's all about the massive destruction, not being subtle. Not a very good choice if his opponent knows how to be underneath the underneath, eh?

and by shocked, of course, I mean not surprised at all, just shaking my head and going 'lol fandom.' XD

Where did you stop reading? (Want a summary? XD)

Nice point about her being a ninja. She'd be raised and trained with the point of view that she's risking her life everyday and she has to be ready to die for the greater good/her country/her clan already. Dying for the guy she loves and has faith in isn't such a big leap.

... DX SasuHina for its own sake is fine, but "omg you write narusaku, quick push sasuke and hinata together!" ... urgh. None of the justifications I can figure out for this reasoning work. "everyone has to be shacked up at the end" is stupid, but "put them together so they won't come back to interfere in teh OTP and make trouble!" is just really... urgh.

As for asking for naruhina in a narusaku story... That baffles me. O_o I mean, he doesn't love her in canon! He's fallen for and shacked up with someone else in the fic! Is the fic labeled a harem story or what, for srs. why would he even look at her if he's happy with Sakura. DX

Bite them. >E

the forums at narutofan.com. DX Cesspool. Yeah.

I'm not super happy that in manga it's so rarely a guy who sacrifices himself so the girl will keep fighting (so she'll have the time to run away, yeah, that happens) but it's so 1000x better than bleach atm. Orihime... wtf hon. Yeah, you're right, you could help but just go and stand on the sidelines and watch as your future is fought for you instead. what. Bleach keeps saying it has strong women, but they're really only strong in stats and pissy behavior. Either they win in one hit or need to get rescued by some manly male, and none of the guys are encouraged to think that surrendering oneself is a form of strength too as both orihime and rukia were. no, THEY get "fight until you die even if you'll lose!!!!" =_____=;;;

... Ahem. sorry. XDD;;;

Ah. That is one place I do not tread. The level of dum scares me. XD

I guess this is what we get for reading shounen manga idk. Still, I'd like to see them push past the stereotypes every once in a while.

Man, I haven't read bleach in like 2 years or something. D: I've been wanting to get caught up, but with some of the stuff I've been hearing lately, I'm not sure I want to. :/

And I just figured out what that picture was in your icon! *dies*

I look forward/do not at all look forward to the next chapter, in that case. Hinata is one of my very favourite characters, but on the other hand, what she did took so much bravery, just as much as those that stayed behind when Naruto needed to move forward while they were chasing Sasuke. I applaud her, and I do hope she'll be okay in the end.

(I ship NejiNaru, and I think all of that pairing nonsense is silly)

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PakkunSakura FTW bitches!

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