askerian: (Askerei_unicorns)
askerian ([personal profile] askerian) wrote2006-10-28 12:55 am

(no subject)

What I did since the last time I updated:

-created culture, religion, notions, specific vocabulary and all that for my mermaids in space story,
-researched moons, tides, underwater life and the like yay, (btw if anyone can explain to me clearly how a planet with three moons on orbit would behave, I'll be happy bcz I'm not entirely sure I get it -- I know the moons can't be on the same orbit; but they don't have to be on concentric orbits either, right? And how big can they reasonably be, if the planet is, say, Earth-sized? Is the Moon the upper size limit or could it be a little bigger before it crashes into its planet?)
-roleplay cracky, sexy things with Saro,
-draw unicornses,
-sleep. lots. (I mean, wtf I know I stayed up 25 hours in a row, but did I really have to sleep 21 hours afterwards to compensate? no, really, body, this isn't funny, you're making me waste internet time. D: )

What I didn't do since the last time I updated:
-write on Teamwork
-Write the drabbles left
-write ANYTHING

So of course, instead of writing, here's a meme, stolen from [livejournal.com profile] windandwater. u.u

Ask me anything about my stories and/or writing process: inspiration, process, characters, what the hell was I thinking, etc. No limit on questions, just ask away.

Also! "ask any of my characters any questions and the character shall reply IC" meme is a go. (unless it's spoiler or they're an asshole about it, that is XD Plz to be telling me which fic!character you're asking about. OCs are alright too.)

[identity profile] reversedhymnal.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 01:15 am (UTC)(link)
Have you ever felt as though your best writing mind-set is when you're so tired it's like every logical lock and dam inside your mind is completely obliterated, and thus, positively anything is more than happy to just flow right out and (possibly) stun your socks off?

tephra: Photo portrait of a doll with shaggy, dark orange and copper hair, wearing a pink slouchy hat and sky blue glasses. (Default)

[personal profile] tephra 2006-10-28 01:42 am (UTC)(link)
The moons would be in concentric orbits if they all formed from accretion. If any of them were captured objects they could have very eccentric orbits.

The last time I bothered to be current with my grad school field of study the leading theory of our own moon's formation was that it was basically the "splash" from a Mars-sized body impacting the earth shortly after differentiation (the metals had already migrated to the core and the lighter materials like silica to the crust.) This is a reasonable way to explain why the moon is mostly made of less dense minerals. Here's a page on that.

How big the moons can be is a really complex question since it's not just the size but the distance of the orbit from the planet and how close the other moons are. My physics skills are WAY too rusty to work out the problem of multiple moons.

Our moon is very large for the size of our planet, and when it first formed it was in a much closer orbit than it is now. The drag of the moon on the earth has actually slowed our rotation and lengthened our day. The moon is still slowing down the rotation of the earth and moving further away. Here's another page on that here.

Also, our moon is rotationally locked with earth so we only see one side of it. I doubt that would happen with multiple moons.

If you really want the nitty gritty you could post on [livejournal.com profile] little_details where there are bound to be people that haven't let their orbital mechanics knowledge rot for over a decade. :)

[identity profile] the--ivorytower.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 01:52 am (UTC)(link)
Oh snap, the other person beat me to it. XD

[identity profile] kaigou.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 01:58 am (UTC)(link)
Here's one: which comes first, the visual that requires a story to explain it, or the story for which you create visuals as you write?

(I don't mean actual drawings, mind you, just "I see this in my head" visuals, although I guess for you personally, "actual drawings" might be just as much of a possibility. For me, only if we're allowing stick figures into the scope o' things.)

[identity profile] joisbishmyoga.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 02:05 am (UTC)(link)
The Moon is not the upper size limit -- see exhibit Pluto-Charon, and ignore the stupid astronomers who demoted Pluto -- nor is it at the minimum distance (though there IS a minimum distance, called a "Roche limit"). Our moon has been gradually widening its orbit over time; four billion years ago, it would've looked fifteen times larger in the sky than it does now. In another I-forget-how-many-million-years, it'll be orbiting so far away that its tidal force won't help keep our planet's axis stable. You'll definitely want a large moon, unless you like wildly-fluctating climates.

Check the gas giants for multiple-moon behavior -- moons will generally be in the same orbital plane as the planet's rotation, but they don't actually have to be orbiting in the same direction as said planet (see: Neptune, Triton). A moon that orbits in the opposite direction than its planet spins is a captured object rather than one that formed with the planet, and if there are moons other than the captured one their orbits may have been tilted far out of the orbital plane (to see an orbital plane, look at gas giant rings; those are all in their planet's orbital plane).

All moons will keep the same face aimed at the planet, and slow the rotation of their planet. For most moons, this planetary slowing is neglible; for those which are a significant fraction of the size of their planet it's very much not. Earth would have a day only about ten hours long without the moon, and Pluto is gravitationally locked with Charon, both keeping the same face aimed at each other.

Depending on how large your three moons are relative to each other, your moons might NOT all keep the same face turned to the planet at all times. This is important for lunar features, if you want any; the back of our moon has no dark marks due to meteoric peppering, because that side isn't blocked by a planet.

It may be possible for a very small moon to orbit another moon rather than the planet. Artists' renditions of extrasolar M-class planets can have the M-class orbiting a gas giant, with a moon orbiting the M-class planet. I would guess such a moon would be a Lagrange object, and be locked in a single place in the sky relative to the M-class and gas giant, but that's just a guess.

[identity profile] sparklemagpie.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 02:26 am (UTC)(link)
Where did the Cybersuke ficcage come from? Did you sort of think one day 'hay, it would be cool if they were androids' and started writing? Or did something specific inspire it?

[identity profile] sparklemagpie.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 02:33 am (UTC)(link)
Aahhha! So a plot bunny was hiding in your smut bag and attacked you! I see! That happens to be ALL THE TIME! @_@ It's highly annoying. >_>

I just wanted them to jump each other! Why is there suddenly a PLOT wtf oh noes!?

.....

*writes anyway*



Thank you! ^__^ <3 You rock!

[identity profile] sparklemagpie.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 02:45 am (UTC)(link)
HAHAH! YOUR ICON! IT KILLS! *ROLLS* XD

Oh dear, yeah, same way for me. I TRIED to make the Uchihacest PWP I really did, but then all the delicious brother-interaction angst jumped me and took me out at the knees with a baseball bat.

*cuddlelovesback*

[identity profile] ina-noranaya.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 02:49 am (UTC)(link)
Zomg! Mental crossovers and walking around the room roleplaying! I knew I couldn't be the only one who did that! (I just don't do anything productive and concrete like writing stuff down. And actually building a story would be beyond my pitiful skills.)

On another note, though bunches of other people have already given world-building advice, this website (http://www.cix.co.uk/~morven/worldkit/index.html) might be helpful. And it has complicated equations, if you like those.

[identity profile] sparklemagpie.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 02:55 am (UTC)(link)
Hmm, that's true. Uchihacest isn't really Uchihacest without emotional baggage.

But... then why does the other smut need a plot? Seriously? Temari/Tayuya sexy lemon goodness? FIVE PAGES OF STORY before I got to the good shit. ;_; It's CRIMINAL!

[identity profile] valles-uf.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 03:04 am (UTC)(link)
I'll dispute some of this.

It is quite possible to have up to three moons sharing the same orbit. One of them, I think always the largest, will be in the middle, and the other two will be located at or orbiting its L4 and L5 points (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lagrangian_point).

The maximum size a moon may have is a question that's dependant on how strict you are with your definition of 'moon (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Natural_satellite)'. Using the loosest sense of the term, I think it should be quite possible for an Earthlike world to have an Earthlike moon - assuming that humans are capable of adapting to long-term life under a relatively modest gravity difference, say, 20%... Surface gravity changes surprisingly slowly when you mess around with a planet's mass, density, volume, etc. - even Jupiter has only a bit over two gs. I can't find the most useful calculator I used to use - lost the link in an HD crash - but these (http://www.cix.co.uk/~morven/worldkit/index.html/) two (http://www.world-builders.org/) sites should be a good start.

The distance at which it orbits is pretty random, but the inner limit is called the Roche Limit (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roche_limit), and if you'll look at the tables at the bottom of the linked page, you'll see that it's possible to get fairly close, if you're talking about an entirely rocky body like our own Moon.

Tidelocking can and does happen in multiple-moon systems - most notably, all four of Jupiter's major moons are fixed that way.

BTW, if you want rings, they're possible for a planet as small as we're talking about, but even a relatively stable ring system will scatter off metorites and other fragments pretty much constantly. Most of these will burn up on their way down, of course, but enough would make it to be a noteworthy hazard for anyone living in the tropics.

Ja, -n

[identity profile] rahedion-woif.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 03:05 am (UTC)(link)
Naruto! A question for you!

Who is better in bed? Sakura or Sasuke?

Kyuubi!

Same Question.

[identity profile] viper-s.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 03:28 am (UTC)(link)
OMG! About that role playing thing (because I'm new and can't figure out how to quote >_<;;), I'm not alone! I thought I was some kind of nut! (not that I'm not...) I'll just be walking home or something and just be muttering to myself and making gestures with my hands, trying to work out a scene, and people'll look at me funny and walk on the other side of the street.

Anyways, I actually have a few questions for the casts of your stories.

Mr. Uchiha Cyborpunk!Sasuke, if I may? Because you are an android, do you find it difficult, before you met Mr. Uzumaki Naruto, to interact with humans on a one on one basis? Was there any specific training you had to undergo, or was everything just programed into you?

Mr. Uzumaki Cyborpunk!Naruto, how is it you became so close to the hospital staff, if you don't mind my asking? Also, seeing as you are a mechanic, do you think you could explain a bit more about how an Uchiha model android, such as Mr. Uchiha Sasuke, might function? Particullarily, how adding certian parts might effect his regular programs.

Ms. Cyborpunk!Asuka Kureru, do you think you might be able to elaborate a bit more on how common human cosmetic surgery, such as animal body parts, is in the current world? Also, what is the public's mindset on such surgeries? Is it a difficult procedure? What's the mortality rate? And is that the only kind of new cosmetic surgery currently happening?

Ms. Haruno Teamwork!Sakura, do you think you might be able to tell us if you have any prefrences as to what your child's name will be? Like, if it's a girl, you'd like her to be called ..., or if it's a boy... etc.? Would you let Naruto or Sasuke pick the names at all? Or would you just like for you all to agree on certain ones?

That's everything for now. Thanks for your time.

-VS

Re: URGH exceeded comment length. XD;;;

[identity profile] viper-s.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 05:37 am (UTC)(link)
Maa, Asuka-san likes her technical jargon!(^_^) ... (O_o) I just get this mental picture of Furry!Naruto going all "Oh yeah, I love it when you talk nerdy to me!" at Cyper!Sasuke (>_<) (and now I want to draw it...)

Thanks for the answers... And as a side note, I love to fangirl over Furry!Naruto, so much so, that I did a fanart for him, just need to get to a half decent scanner first... If you ever do another of those random drabbles, I'm so requesting a day in the life of Furry!Naruto. (>_>) (
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Maa, Asuka-san likes her technical jargon!(^_^) ... (O_o) I just get this mental picture of Furry!Naruto going all "Oh yeah, I love it when you talk nerdy to me!" at Cyper!Sasuke (>_<) (and now I want to draw it...)

Thanks for the answers... And as a side note, I love to fangirl over Furry!Naruto, so much so, that I did a fanart for him, just need to get to a half decent scanner first... If you ever do another of those random drabbles, I'm <i>so</i> requesting a day in the life of Furry!Naruto. (>_>) (<_<) (>_<) Sorry.
ext_109532: spry bit of trouble (bunnylove)

[identity profile] ashesmuse.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 06:04 am (UTC)(link)
mermaids in space?
*tries to figure that one out while drugged*

[identity profile] animeprincess.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 06:19 am (UTC)(link)
random stupid question: Is Reiyel's horn bigger for a reason? ^^;;;;;;

[identity profile] animeprincess.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 08:30 am (UTC)(link)
Oh, slick. little details that make that pic even better. ^_^

[identity profile] nothri.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 12:20 pm (UTC)(link)
One thing you might want to keep in mind for the moons is that our moon, although far from the largest possible size, is considered large compared to most moons orbitting other planets. What that means is that our moon is big compared to the size of the planet it orbits. There are bigger moons out there- some larger than Earth, in fact- but they usually orbit planets many many times their own size. Earth's moon is a appreciable fraction of Earth's size, which is an oddity in our system.

Okay, brief mention of tides. On earth we have two major tidal forces- one from the pull of the moon and the other from the pull of the sun. For the purposes of our discussion here, I'm going to assume that each moon has roughly the same pull on your world's tides as Earth's moon does (that's a big oversimplification of the matter- the size and distance of each moon will affect how much or how little that moon pulls on the oceans, but bear with me here). You're looking at four "normal" tides- one from the world's sun and one from each moon. In addition, you're looking at a couple "uber tides" when two of the moons cross orbits, or when a moon crosses the sun's orbit. And on top of that, you'd rarely have one uber uber tide when all three moons cross orbits, or two moons cross the sun's path. And rarest of all, one utlra mega gigaslave tide when all three moons cross the sun's path at once.

Its also *possible* for an object to share an orbit with another and not run into that object at some point, but not likely. If your moons did share an orbit, the chances that they would move at the same speed so that the three never collided is practically nill....unless they had been *put* there by something....

Okay, I go back to lurking now.

[identity profile] narsksas.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 01:48 pm (UTC)(link)
I don't have time right now to read all of your replies, so I don't know if this has been answered or yet not. But here you are.

Earth has high and low tides, two a day, roughly. A planet with more moons, would, in theroy, have more tides. So three moons, 6 different tides a day. And depending on the size of the moons, and distance they orbit rom the planet, they would vary in time from each other and in strength.

I don't know if that helps, but I thought I'd mention it.

[identity profile] valles-uf.livejournal.com 2006-10-28 06:01 pm (UTC)(link)
...

ohgodican'tbelievei'mdoingthis.

Okay; Lessee if I can dig up those calculators if I take another crack at them...

No, but I've done the math anyway, along with some I've meant to do for a project of my own.

Earth
Diameter: 12,744 km (1)
Density: 5.5 g/cm^3 (1)
Mass: 5.9742*10^24 kg (1)
Viewing Angle: NA
Albedo: 0.367
Orbital Period: 1 year

Luna
Diameter: 3,476 km (0.27)
Density: 3.3 g/cm^3 (0.6)
Mass: 7.347673*10^22 kg (0.01)
Viewing Angle: 0.5 degrees
Albedo: 0.12
Magnitude: -12.74
Orbital Period: 27 days

(I don't think I need to go into any details about these two, do I?)


A's Waterworld
Diameter: 16,270 km (1.2)
Density: 4.7 g/cm^3 (0.85)
Mass: 1.0574*10^25 kg (1.77)
Viewing Angle:
Albedo: ~0.3 - ~0.35 (~1)
Orbital Period: ?

Able
Diameter: 4,080 km (0.32)
Density: 4.9 g/cm^3 (0.89)
Mass: 1.9914*10^23 kg (0.03)
Viewing Angle: 1.5 degrees (3)
Albedo: ~0.08?
Orbital Period: 5.6 days

Baker
Diameter: 2,600 km (0.41)
Density: 4.2 g/cm^3 (0.76)
Mass: 4.2673*10^23 kg (0.07)
Viewing Angle: 0.9 degrees (1.8)
Albedo: ~0.1?
Orbital Period: 17 days

Charlie
Diameter: 1,400 km (0.22)
Density: 4.3 g/cm^3 (0.78)
Mass: 6.4238*10^22 kg (0.01)
Viewing Angle: 0.2 degrees (0.4)
Albedo: ~0.1?
Orbital Period: 71 days

(My gift to you. ^_^

More seriously, the primary's lower density was picked for two reasons - one, I'm seeing this system as forming in a less... cataclysmic fashion than Earth's did, and two, most of our vulcanism is, according to my geology prof, caused by the heat from isotopic decay at the Earth's core. Lighter planet = lower proportion of radioactive heavy elements = less heat = less vulcanism.

Wait, what? Well, there's a powerful example in our own system that tidal action can cause the same kinds of heating and activity - Io. Tidal forces on a planet are proportional to the mass of the moon and the inversely proportional to the
square of its distance. Since the first two of those moons are both closer and heavier than our own, this pretty much means that that planet's innards are seriously stirred about, all the time.

Since having
both of these effects working at once would probably get you something... rather like Io, I think it'd be a good idea to have your waterworld actually be a fairly old planet, maybe as much as half-again Earth's age, orbiting a long-lived star somewhere in the K class.

As nothri notes towards the bottom of this page, having all of the moons on the same plane would magnify the range of tidal forces, which IIUC is what you're looking for.

Anyway, you can feel free to use or not use these numbers as you see fit, or take any sort of poetic liberties you like - my feelings won't be hurt any either way. ^_^



V's Desert World
Diameter: 18,928 km (1.48)
Density: 4.3 g/cm^3 (0.78)
Mass: 1.5294*10^25 kg (2.56)
Viewing Angle: 21 degrees (42)
Albedo: ~5.5
Orbital Period: 21.7 hours

V's Living Moon
Diameter: 11,654 km (0.91)
Density: 5.9 g/cm^3 (1.1)
Mass: 4.7794*10^24 kg (0.80)
Viewing Angle: 15 degrees (30)
Albedo: ~3.5
Orbital Period: 21.7 hours

These two are tidally locked to each other, meaning that they both have the same length day, with in turn is the same as their orbital periods. I'm not sure where the barycenter of the system would be, but it's likely well outside the larger world. Both of them have earthlike tectonic plates and such despite that difference, but the larger boiled off the vast majority of its water long ago - essentially, try and imagine it as what Earth would be like with all of its fresh water but none of the seas. Since water vapor is by far the most potent greenhouse gas, this means that the primary is one of your cold deserts, not roasting like the Sahara. Between vulcanism (it got all the heavy isotopes) and the fact that it kept its water, the 'moon' is a hothouse, with only the poles reaching what we would consider temperate climates. The rest is wall-to-wall jungle all the way up to the tree line.

Ja, -n
(wouldn't have ranted about his own projects if he hadn't spent half his day crunching those numbers - but had, and is therefore proud of them, dammit!)

[identity profile] rahedion-woif.livejournal.com 2006-10-29 12:02 am (UTC)(link)
For Teamwork!Sasuke: Hey! You. What do you think of the Hyuuga?

[identity profile] nothri.livejournal.com 2006-10-29 08:32 pm (UTC)(link)
To Sasuke of Teamwork: How did Orochimaru die when you failed to show up at his doorstep? Do you ever have any regrets about avoiding his offer?

[identity profile] alexandrukas.livejournal.com 2006-10-30 04:45 am (UTC)(link)
I'll jump in here and state that some of the best inspiration I get for writing is just walking around my room imagining what is going on in the story while talking for the characters

[identity profile] narsksas.livejournal.com 2006-10-31 12:46 am (UTC)(link)
No problem, dear. I am here to humbly serve my masters.